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Australian Property Podcast 100th Episode Recap: Tyrone Shum

Updated 30/11/2017

In this special episode, the tables are being turned on our host, Tyrone Shum, creator of the Australian property podcast. As a property investor and former real estate agent himself, he is a digital disruptor who uncovers Australia’s most successful property experts’ stories, strategies, and mindsets to over 30,000 listeners a month.

For Property Investory’s 100th birthday you’ll follow Tyrone’s own journey on how it all started, gain insight into some of the funniest, best and worst moments that have been shared with us on the show and uncover the challenges which have been overcome to get to where Property Investory is today!

'The real wealth is through property increasing in value, e.g. what we call capital growth and that's where you build up your asset base.'

Tyrone Shum

Mathew Robinson: 

Tyrone usually begins his interviews by asking his guests to brag about their achievements and how far they’ve come. Well, now it’s his turn to brag.

Tyrone Shum:

My full name is Tyrone Shum and I'm the host of Property Investory, as you probably all know and what I've done in the past is quite varied. I've been in the digital marketing/intel industry for quite a number of years actually, close to a decade and I've had a lot of experience in that side of things in terms of my career and profession.

I've also been featured across numerous Australian podcasts and appeared on various different blogs and also named in the Top 100 for certain things around marketing. So that's my career aspirations and career achievements. What I've also done in terms of property investing, still in the sense that I'm also a learner right now, the reason why I'm interviewing all these guests is that I want to be able to learn and share that along my journey as well. So that's really where I'm coming from in terms of property investing.

Mathew Robinson: 

So what does a regular day look like for Tyrone?

Tyrone Shum:

My day, as I work a full-time job, I work in a large building products company and I am the group digital manager. So as I mentioned earlier, I am very much involved in the digital marketing side of things for over a decade. So for me on a day to day basis, I'm managing numerous websites and doing a lot of marketing and also a digital transformation for the business as well.

On the other side of things, I dedicate my time much so that I will actually interview and look for new experts to come onto the Property Investory podcast. It's a passion of mine, so for me, it's quite easy to hop on and interview these guests and I’m really energised by them and that's what keeps motivating me to do this and share this podcast with everyone.

Mathew Robinson:

Having interviewed so many interesting people on the show, he has been privy to some hilarious stories where things just seemed to go from bad to worse.

Tyrone Shum:

One of the funniest moments I've had was when I interviewed a guest by the name of Ben

Everingham and he shared with me one of his worst investing moments. When he did, I thought the first part of it when he actually told me that something happened to his house e.g. he had people breaking in and trashed the place, basically, in one of his properties a little bit out of the Sydney area. And I thought, ‘OK, that's fine. That seems to be a story that I've heard before, somebody coming in and trashing their place, or a tenant living there and trashing their place,’ and that's fine.

But then he said to me, ‘Look, that's only one aspect. It gets worse.’ And he kept telling me story, after story, after story and it kept getting worse and worse and I just could not sit there and not laugh about it because it just got so bad.

Ben Everingham:

then there six detectives there and then escorted back up and as they've called the backup and sectioned off this street. These adults have run out of the property apparently four of them have got away and four of them have been putting cuffs. Sorry is this okay? sorry like it's pretty. It's the most extreme example of what could ever happen to a property. 

Tyrone Shum: 

I think that's why I'm very happy that you have a very good story. This is what I love this story.

Ben Everingham: This like where it just escalates over a period of weeks. So these people for the fourth hammering cuffs and about to be put in the car. Then a couple of the neighbours come out to have AVO on these people in the house. And they start breaking off fence palings and getting cricket bats and then attacking these people that have their arms cuffed behind them.

Tyrone Shum:

it got to the point where like his property got on fire because of illegal usage of power. Secondly, he actually appeared in the news because it was that bad in the neighbourhood. So it just got worse and worse.

Ben Everingham (snippet):

Over the 10 day period, there were two more knife fights and that tenants during those fights broke every single window in the property and put their heads and arms through about every single wall in the house so the entire house is now destroyed internally.

And so that's where the second insurance claim comes on top of the first one and then you know they've left. They've vacated the property but before they have it's a long weekend and the electricity companies cut the power off so the person in my property got an extension cord illegally plugged it into the neighbour's house and he's running the entire house off this one cord and it's raining. The cord catches fire and has to be put out again.

Mathew Robinson:

I can’t believe his tenant actually set his house on fire!

Tyrone Shum:

So the whole place was kind of burnt down. And it got featured in the news because fire engines had to attend, police had to go. It was pretty bad. You know you think trashing the place is fine, but then to the point where it got into the media! It's got to be a moment to remember.

Mathew Robinson:

Growing up in Sydney, Shum studied Computer Science before entering the IT industry. But along the way he picked up Robert Kiyosaki’s famous Rich Dad Poor Dad and he began to forge a new path for himself.

Tyrone Shum:

I studied at school in Sydney and this school was in Summer Hills at a private school. Awesome upbringing there had a lot of great opportunities to be able to be involved in extracurricular activities, it made me really a well-rounded person. I achieved quite well academically, so therefore I was able to get into university and I went to the University of NSW studying a Bachelor of Computer Science. So it's pretty much up my alley in terms of IT and so forth. But as you probably realised, over the last say close to 15-16 years or so since I've been in that industry, a lot has changed. We never had digital marketing or digital as an actual area of the industry since I finished computer science. I was basically going into the workforce and doing a little bit of website development and that would be it. 

But it expanded into a huge industry and since I went into that industry, I did a little bit of full-time work in IT for a couple of years and then after I built that experience up, I actually decided to make a bit of a turning point. The turning point happened was when I read the book Rich Dad Poor Dad, it kind of struck me and gave me some insight into, ‘Man, I probably don't see myself working in a full-time job for the rest of my life.’ So it kind of inspired me to get into business and that's why at the same time, while I was actually going to work full time, I was actually doing a sport that I really loved called dragon boating. And when I did that, it kind of got me into the opportunities to see if there was a business I could create out of it. And it actually did! So I started a paddle business in dragon boating, selling dragon boat paddles to pretty much all the clubs all across Australia. That started out as a fantastic business which I ran for about almost three years actually full time and generated over six figures quite well. So I was quite an entrepreneur/business person when I went straight into that business.

Mathew Robinson:

Following his exciting venture into his dragon boating business, Tyrone was inspired to learn about property investing from renowned guru, Steve McKnight.

Tyrone Shum:

Being an entrepreneur, I got a little bit itchy and I delved into doing a bit of property investing. That's where I joined up to do Steve McKnight's Results Mentoring Program. I was actually in the first intake, the first-ever intake - and I’m going back to the early 2000s when I actually joined that. That's where I met a lot of people in property investing and proper investors who actually share their stories about doing positive cash flow. 

Steve McKnight:

There are some other accounts about people who have been following my real-estate training and the successes that they’ve had so it’s a very good read.
I mean it’s one of the best-selling business books ever. Sold over three hundred copies and a book doesn’t do that unless there’s some value in it. So for those of you who haven’t read ‘From 0 to 130 Properties in Three and a Half Years’ go to your local bookstore and pick up a copy and grab it on Amazon Kindle or whatever you want. 

Tyrone Shum:

Because back then Steve McKnight was very much of a guru and still is today, talking about buying positive cash flow properties. It's not so easy as it is in today's market as it was back then, but back then you could pretty much buy a property and then just use the formula that he taught us and work out if it was positive cash flow.

Mathew Robinson:

And that’s what he did!

Tyrone Shum:

I actually went out and bought my first positive cash flow property which was out in Central NSW at a location called West Wyalong; so that's when my journey first started. At the same time, I thought, ‘OK, I've got the first cash flow property, or positive cash flow my property, I just didn't have enough money to save up for the next property.’ So what I did was I jumped into renting places and then subletting them out individually for each room, to be able to generate some additional cash flow on a week-to-week basis. That worked out really well for the period of time I tried that.

It taught me a lot of great things because one, I realised you could actually rent out a property. Say maybe if you're looking back at an example, when I rented out properties in like Eastwood and stuff, I could pick them up for like $500 a week for rent, then I could rent them all out for each room of a four-bedroom for $140 a week, which equated to almost $600, so I could actually profit $100 a week just from subletting these rooms out to uni students and full-time workers. That gave me basically a good cash flow and I think I rented out from memory, it was about six properties. So it was able to generate $600 a week additional revenue, just from doing that. And that's where my probably investing journey started.

Mathew Robinson:

As mentioned, the motivation behind Tyrone’s business ventures and property investing stemmed from Kiyosaki’s Rich Dad Poor Dad and the four quadrants.

Tyrone Shum:

That's where it started me to actually think, as Robert Kiyosaki talks a lot about running your own business and also moving into the investing quadrant. So if you look back at the four quadrants - if listeners don't know what that is, Robert Kiyosaki has four quadrants he says that we either fall into E quadrant which is the employee, the S quadrant which is the self-employed, then you’ve got the B quadrant which is the business owner and then the I quadrant which is the investor. He encourages as much as you can to move from the E and S quadrants into the B and I quadrants. And that's what I tried to do, to set up systems and a process where I could actually be a business owner and also an investor at the same time.

Mathew Robinson:

From there he began to learn more about the property by training as a real estate agent.

Tyrone Shum:

So after I went into IT, this was just before I started running my own business, I was actually a real estate agent. So after reading that book Rich Dad Poor Dad, I decided I'm going to change my career path rather than stick in IT for that period because I started to kind of dread going into work every day, programming. You know, it's pretty tedious after a while so it kind of got me thinking, ‘I want to actually improve my skill set and learn how to sell.’

And that's why I jumped into learning all about real estate, so that way I can learn to sell because the beautiful thing about jumping into the real estate industry is that they provide phenomenal sales training. With a very large company that I was with, which was LJ Hooker and also Ray White, they provided excellent sales training and I thought, ‘Why not get that training as part of my work and learn from there?’ They did teach me a lot of great sales skills that helped me to be able to move into the future businesses that I got into.

Mathew Robinson:

So what inspired Tyrone to begin a podcast about property investing?

Tyrone Shum:

I kind of got fed up because I was hearing a lot of great podcasts out there talking a lot about the specific strategies and how-tos. But then there was missing a component behind it, which was that inspiration and the stories behind why people did it. Because I think in my journey, I find that the ‘why’ is much stronger to drive myself to actually do something, rather than just going, ‘OK, I can learn all the strategies and all the techniques, but still for some reason, I find that I won't apply.’ And I think that that seems to resonate with a lot of people. People can go to all these seminars, go and do all the training, but until they actually ask themselves, ‘Why?’ to find out and discover that within themselves, nothing will change. That's what I discovered for myself is when I started hearing all about these great stories about people why they're going into property investing, it actually helped me determine what my ‘why’ is as well. So I guess for me, I kind of grew out of frustration and I just thought, ‘I want to create something that I could actually listen to.’

And on top of that, I was running out of podcasts to listen to on a daily basis because I was driving one way into work and my way back and that was almost an hour round trip. I was listening to podcasts that were released weekly and I’d probably get through them within about three weeks quite fast. So I really was dying to get more podcasts on a regular basis. 

[Another thing which inspired me] was listening to other podcasts like Freakonomics, which I pretty much got through in about a month. They've got great episodes and they've been doing it for three years already but they only release it once a week. I felt that I could resonate with the way they actually structured their podcast and the stories that they delivered them - it was really interesting. And I thought, ‘I could easily model off that because I've got experience in video production and audio production from all the digital marketing I've done.’ That's pretty much where I got the idea and concept and made it really unique in that sense and that's how Property Investory came along in terms of its structure and its storyline and how we actually put this all together and that's what it's all been about. So I guess I was the ideal person, or the avatar, who wanted this kind of podcast and interestingly enough when I finally released it and put into the market there were so many people like me that wanted to do this and wanted to listen to this as well.

Mathew Robinson:

Shum’s experience in digital marketing has played a significant role in making Property Investory a reality, allowing him to reach many Australians who are also eager to learn about property investing and the stories behind it.

Tyrone Shum:

If it wasn't for the skills and experience I've had in terms of digital, I don't know if I could’ve actually got that kind of reach. I'll share with you my previous experience. I have actually done and created about two separate podcasts in the past in a totally different niche, one was in blogging and another niche was in video marketing. Because of those two podcasts I actually did, I did a very similar structure where I went out, interviewed a lot of experts and got them onto the podcast and my first podcast generated easily over 10,000 downloads a month just from doing that. It was spreading quite far reach from what I was doing. I got to a point where I was getting kind of tired out, just due to the fact that I was focusing on so many other parts of the businesses that I was doing at that time, that's why I couldn't put much more effort into it.

And on top of that, every Tom, Dick and Harry were launching their own podcasts about blogging too, so the space got really crowded and very quickly - it is very hard to stand out. So I basically moved on to doing video marketing, which I passionately enjoyed and that was one of the other businesses that I ran. And you’ll probably find out from me that I've run a lot of businesses in the past over this period of time and finally, I've settled down to do something that I've been really passionate about, which is property - [00:19:25] I've just stuck to my guns on this one and made sure that I'm delivering the best I can from this. Also learning as much as I can along the way because this journey of property investing is a consistent and long term experience for me because I'm touching so many people but also learning from so many experts out there.

Mathew Robinson:

And Property Investory’s success is growing.

Tyrone Shum:

So as of I think about a week ago we actually hit 100,000 downloads and that was the turning point for this. So I guess when people listen to this episode being the 100th episode, we’re probably going to be more than 100,000 downloads then. 

When we started this podcast towards the end of May/early June 2017, we've had consistent exponential growth and it's been accumulated all throughout that time. As we speak right now, sort of mid-November that we're doing this interview, where we're more than 100,000 downloads at this point in time and I definitely want to thank the audience and the listeners out there who have been listening to this podcast for all your support and encouragement and also spreading the word. It's just grown so fast and it's been phenomenal.

Mathew Robinson:

The very first property Shum bought in Central West NSW was such a great opportunity on paper… but would end up causing one of his worst investing moments.

Tyrone Shum:

I love this question! Every time I ask I'm sitting on the edge of my seat waiting to hear what could be the worst outcome for them and I've had some really bad horror stories, just to name a few. I guess one of them has been shared already with you with regards to one of the guests, but for my own experience as I mentioned when I first started investing into property the first property I bought and that was one that I've learnt my lesson to buy in the Central NSW area of West Wyalong. It was a great property because it had dual income, had a residential side income from the top and also commercial side down the bottom. So I had dual income coming from the top and the bottom. The thing that I made a huge mistake with - and because I was being cheap as well - I didn’t hire a property management company and I thought, ‘OK I can take this on myself.’ It was a rural location which is at least eight hours drive from Sydney, probably even longer and need to really catch a plane to get out there. It also had a tenant who was in there for about five or six years, so it was definitely stable. But the problem was I didn't foresee the kind of problems that would come about, managing this property myself.

West Wyalong isn’t a very big town, it's actually a very small town with a few thousand people in the population, so you can imagine demographics were quite small. That's what attracted me to this was because of the positive cash flow, I got easily 10% return per annum from it, but it was also the business side of things was not very strong. This person ran an IT business. And yes, there are businesses out there who need IT support and that's why he ran it. But it got to the point where he was not getting enough work locally and was struggling to pay the rent. I started to see that happen because I was not paying much attention to that and I thought, ‘OK I’ll follow up with him and see why he's delayed on rent after a few weeks or so and chase him up,’ and so forth. There's not much more we can do except just call them, email them and ask them to pay the rent. You know you can't just go down and knock on the door, fly out there and say, ‘You've got to pay the rent,’ on-demand and stuff. It got to some point where I think he was about three months in arrears and I thought, ‘I don't know what I'm going to do.’ I made a huge mistake not to have someone in, you shouldn't let a tenant be in arrears for that long.

Mathew Robinson:

Then another problem arose, which really made him wish he had hired a property manager!

Tyrone Shum:

On top of that, we had a major issue with one of the awnings at the front which was somehow infested with all these birds nests and it got so heavy it pretty much was just about to break open. I had to make the decision to fly out there one time - that was my first and only time for me to go out there to have a look at the property. I have to make another statement here to say that I made a bad decision to purchase the property unseen as well. So for three years before I just purchased it and let the tenant pay his rent and do its a thing. And that's fine for two years as I mentioned, but it was that last year when things just turned bad. So I was three months in arrears, the awning was about to break down or fall apart and I made the decision to fly out there and have a look.

When I flew out there it was fantastic because I actually got to meet the tenant, I got to see the property itself and it was in good nick. It wasn't a shabby kind of place but you could tell that it needed a little bit of work. And I was thinking to myself, ‘Gosh, if I was to get some renovations done, how much will it cost to renovate the place and make the major repairs needed?’ It basically cost the same amount as probably three years’ worth of rent. So I thought, ‘I'll just do some very minor repairs and hopefully I can claim back on landlords insurance and get some things done.’

About a month after that when I flew back into Sydney, the city had a major storm and actually flooded the awning and it started creating a waterfall fountain in front of the glass windows - every time it rained the whole window would be just covered in water! So you could imagine the front of the retail shop outlet. And it just got worse and worse and to a point where I was getting concerned because if that fell on anyone, I would be up for a huge public liability.

Mathew Robinson:

Then the landlord’s insurance came to his rescue, covering a hefty sum in damages to his property.

Tyrone Shum:

Luckily we got that one fixed, so I got straight on to that, got people out there to pretty much rip the whole thing apart, took photos for me and the whole awning was covered in bird's nests. That's the reason why it got so heavy and it was just about to fall apart. Within a short time, I think about a month or so, the tradespeople got it fixed up and I was able to claim that all back on insurance. So thank God for landlord’s insurance and also the property insurance I put on that property, for the three years I paid out insurance I got that all back and it was easily almost $10,000 worth of damages and claims I had to do. So for $300 a year over three years, I got my money's worth out of it. That was probably one of my worst investing moments, I've learnt my lesson - never, ever invest into property without a property manager and secondly, make sure that you get landlord’s insurance or property insurance for whatever property you have.

Mathew Robinson:

Yeah, I hate to think what would have happened if you hadn't had that property insurance.

Tyrone Shum:

Yeah, I think I would have been in tears for a while. It would have been a very hard learning lesson and since then, I've definitely made sure even the property I have in Sydney right now, I have property insurance on it. I also have a property manager and everything is managed without me even having to touch a thing and I get rent paid every week without a problem. We've had a few minor repairs, but that's minor compared to the issues I could have had.

Mathew Robinson:

After this huge learning experience, he eventually sold the property… for less than he expected.

Tyrone Shum:

When I first bought that property, I bought it for $106,000 and that was probably early 2000s. I held it for a few years and when I sold it, I got it $101,000 back from it, so I actually lost $5,000 along the way, it didn't grow at all. I guess the rent was positive so it did sort of break-even, but the whole learning experience was that I won’t invest in a town like that for a long, long time if I ever needed to again.

**MINDSET AND STRATEGY**

Mathew Robinson:

Some of the best advice Tyrone has received from people he’s interviewed on the show has been about renovating and adding value to the property.

Tyrone Shum:

When I was living at home with my family, my father was very much of a renovator. I remember growing up he was involved in renovating his home in Strathfield, which was our first family home and obviously from that renovation it made a huge profit and he was able to sell it. The second thing was when he bought his next property, which was down in the Gladesville area, he renovated that property and within a very short period of time, he resold it down the track and made quite a substantial profit from it. So I learned a lot about renovations through my dad because I helped out quite a bit, he actually got me on the tools and said, ‘I want you to do this, this and this.’

It was great, but I think the biggest thing that I've learnt just from talking to all the people who I've interviewed is to actually not get on the tools because it's a trade-off. If you're good at doing renovations, great, get on the tools and do all that. But the biggest lesson for me is to actually hire people to help you do that because the time and effort that you spend in actually doing renovations yourself, you could actually pay a professional who’d do a much better job for a price, but the time that you spent in something could be spent somewhere else more productively, or help you generate more income. So it's really opportunity cost if you want to put that word to it. It's the opportunity cost of where your time is spent and if I'm ever going to add value to any property such as renovations or development, I have learnt now to hire professionals and consultants to help me do any type of renovations or any development. And I think that's been the best advice I've learnt from all this.

Mathew Robinson:

Shum also referred back to Jason John Byron who went down a similar path starting his property investing journey with renovations.

Jason John Byron (snippet):

We did the renovations ourselves. We knew nothing. People know me as a paintbrush guy. I got up on the roof, we had a very small paintbrush - I think it was two centimetres wide - because I'd never done it before but it can't be that hard to paint something, because we thought the roof needed painting because it was just red and rusty. But I went down to the local hardware store, just a city boy kind of thing, going, ‘Where’s the paint, where’s a brush?’ He just points me, ‘There's a brush,’ and I just thought, there's a brush, I didn't look any further.

Then the place next door, we hired people. They went somewhere, they picked it up, they put it there and then we just told them what to do. We did a little bit of painting and laid some lawn and that, but the amount of effort is what resonates with me today. People like renovating, there's nothing wrong with it, but there is so much effort for the reward sometimes - there's no definite what you're going to get for it, at the end of the day no one would say, ‘I'm going to get the amount.’ It is a lot of time out of your day and a lot of time away from your family, I think people kind of don't look at that time and how it affects it.

So it was five times the amount of equity increase on the one that we got everyone else to do the work. Then the one that we did all the work. So from that point forward, we were like, ‘No I’m not lifting another brush. If I can make this work, we are paying someone else to do it and managing them. Have a system and make sure I get systemised, then that's what I want to be doing.’

Mathew Robinson:

Tyrone has shaped his mindset from speaking to these experts, as well as listening to other podcasts and surrounding himself with people who have a positive impact on his way of thinking.

Tyrone Shum:

I've got a thirst for learning and I really enjoy speaking to a lot of experts and also tapping on their shoulder to find out exactly how they've done it and asking the questions along their journey. By asking the right questions, they will actually share with you the specific things that can help you change your mindset.

One other thing is surrounding yourself with people who you want to be like them one day. So for example, if you’re inspired to be a property developer you want to surround yourself with property developers who have succeeded and then work with them or learn from them or even become like an apprentice with them. And if you surround yourself with them on a day to day basis, you will become them. It’s true the saying goes, usually, it’s the top five people that you hang around more than likely will determine what your future will be. I realised that just from my mindset, because growing up and also being in this industry I had surrounded myself with a lot of business owners for a long time and I ended up becoming a business owner. Since I started this podcast I’ve surrounded myself with property investors and being surrounded by so many of them, I have become a stronger and more knowledgeable investor myself and that has helped change my mindset.

Mathew Robinson:

He particularly liked a quote from Daniel Walsh.

Daniel Walsh (snippet):

“You’re the average of your best five friends”. So whoever you keep around you is pretty much who you're going to become. So if you hang around with five successful people, you'll become successful. If you hang around with five people that do drugs, you’re probably going to do drugs.

Tyrone Shum:

Because it's very easy to get caught up in the day to day life of work as well, coming from like a nine to five type of job and doing the work I need to do. But if you don't break free from that, you will get stuck in a rut. That’s why doing this podcast has also been a huge benefit for my mindset. I listen to a lot of other podcasts from as I mentioned, Freakonomics to How I Built This, inspirational types of podcasts that give me the motivation. I listen to a lot of property investing podcasts as well to gain the knowledge and details, tips and techniques I need to invest in my own journey and my personal development for the property.

Mathew Robinson:

Creating a successful podcast has meant securing interviews with many prominent people in the property industry. So has he experienced any challenges along the way?

Tyrone Shum:

I'd be lying if I didn't. It has been a huge journey and there have been lots of challenging times for sure. I think for me it was just being persistent to follow up with them. There were so many great experts when you first initially start out, you've got absolutely no downloads, no proven track record or any successful experts on your podcast, no one wants to come on to it. It's like if there are no experts on the podcast, they don't know if you're trustworthy to come on. So it was building up that relationship with a lot of the experts and luckily for me, the first few that I actually approached were people who mentored me and were experts in the market.

I’ll give you some examples of them - Steve McKnight, who was my mentor in the results program, Brendan Kelly was my property coach when I was going through the results mentoring program and I did that for about three years. So I had that existing relationship with them. And because Brendan has a lot of contacts in the industry, he also knew John Lindeman, he knew a few other people and when I started reaching out to them and getting interviews it kind of opened up the door for me to be able to tap into the other experts. So when I got those guys in an interview, I'd start approaching people like Chris Gray, Jane Slack-Smith and so forth. I just mentioned that I had interviewed John Lindeman and Steve McKnight, etc and when they heard the other names, well-known experts, straight away they hopped on the podcast and were more than happy to share that time. That's how I began to sort of leapfrog per se into getting more prominent experts in the industry.

Mathew Robinson:

Since then, plenty of well-known speakers like Margaret Lomas and Michael Yardney have come onto the podcast and shared their knowledge with Tyrone.

Tyrone Shum:

There's just so many who have come onto the podcast. They have been more than generous to give their time and share their knowledge and that's what's made this podcast so interesting - because they’re from so many different walks of life, each and everyone has their own individual story, whether they're an expert or just starting out. And that's what's been really really fun about this podcast as well.

So that's how I really got started and I think to prove that I could actually get an audience and build that up was also a challenge because you've got already numerous podcasts out there who are already ranked number one in the Top 10 and so forth and you're going to actually stand out amongst them. I had to find creative and interesting ways to actually get the kind of traction that I needed and by doing that, that's what made me stood out. So obviously from a marketing standpoint, I made sure my clients were different, that was one of the key elements. In saying that, I focused on the core message which was delivering a story about property investors. Not tips, not strategies, just the story behind why these investors did what they did.

Mathew Robinson:

When conducting interviews, there are some questions that Tyrone really loves to ask his guests.

Tyrone Shum:

One of my favourite questions I love asking is the worst investing moment. So when I ask them, ‘If you could take me back to a story where you had your worst investment moment where you had the lowest of the low, share with us that story so that way we can learn a lesson from it.’ That one is probably one of my favourites because it really digs deep into their challenges. Because we all hear the success stories, but at the same time not many people want to share their failures and learning lessons and that's where the real gems are, in my opinion. By asking that question it really shows their true character, how they handle situations and how they actually grow from that and that's what I think makes us all better. Not only just as property investors, but also personally develop as a better person. So that's probably one of my favourite questions.

Another one I love asking as well, this is usually towards the end of the interview, is ‘If you had met yourself 10 years ago, what would you say to him or her?’ That always opens up insights in what people think about what they could have done in hindsight. 

Dymphna Boholt:

Hi I'm Dymphna Boholt from I Love Real Estate and

Ten years ago I would say you're in for a wild ride. 

Well you know everything you do creates who you are bad good and bad experiences create who you are. And I really feel it's not something that you go back and say I wish I'd done this I wish I'd done that. Because you know even the mistakes are benefits to you if you learn from them. 

Mathew Robinson:

Another question Shum likes to ask his guests is: what is the biggest a-ha moment in their property journey? But what was his biggest a-ha moment?

Tyrone Shum:

This is the thing that I wish I knew - and this is all in hindsight. When I first started investing in property, all I knew and all I learnt about positive cash flow was to buy property and just buy more positive cash flow which would help you build up your portfolio. What I didn't realise and what I only learned more in the last few years, is about buying property with growth in them to be able to build up equity. Because the real wealth is through property increasing in value, e.g. what we call capital growth and that's where you build up your asset base.

Mathew Robinson:

He shares an example of how this works and how he learnt from this knowledge.

Tyrone Shum:

If you bought a property going back 10 years ago for $500,000 in Sydney, 10 years later - usually between seven to 10 years on average, this is what they say, don't quote me on this - is that it will double in price. And It is true if you go back and have a look at say Jan Somers’ books she's listed out properties that were bought back in the 1900s and you can see that it's been doubled pretty much every 10 years or so. So if you knew that and went on that trajectory or that path for that period of time, you'll soon discover that if you follow that concept then you can build equity or build what they call capital growth into your portfolio over time. So it's basically being in the market by buying and holding a property.

So if I bought one 10 years ago for $500,000, looking at it 10 years later it would be worth $1 million and that extra $500,000 is something that happens because the market grows. If you hold on to a property, you can basically grow a portfolio that doubles every 10 years; the real wealth is not necessarily through just buying cash flow properties and that's the mistake I made back then was just to buy one cashflow property and then hopefully buy the next one and so forth It's great to be able to do that, but how much cash flow would you need to build up a portfolio with an extra $500,000 equity. If you work that out, you'd need at least 50 to 100 properties and most people just don't have the skill to go and buy that many properties.

So if I had learned this lesson earlier and this is my biggest a-ha moment, it's about buying in growth areas e.g. capital cities within Australia, that's where you can actually generate real wealth and that's where you grow an asset base. So if you had bought five properties 10 years ago worth $500,000 each you would have bought them for $2.5 million. And if you hold it for 10 years, you would be sitting on an asset base of $5 million dollars now, with an additional $2.5 million of equity which you can draw out and use any time to buy more properties or invest into other things. Or alternatively, you can sell down half and then pay that off and hopefully, the rent will cover you and give you some passive income. So it depends on what strategy you are looking for, but I think the biggest a-ha moment for me is learning about buying growth properties that will help you build real wealth in the future.

Mathew Robinson:

Ultimately, property investing is a learning experience where people are constantly evolving their strategies to reach their goals - and that’s what Tyrone has discovered through Property Investory and his own journey.

Tyrone Shum:

It's all a journey you know, at the end a day it doesn't matter if you've got a big portfolio and you have that for living off in your retirement or passive income. But at the end of the day, it's the journey and the learning lessons that you take along the way because if you lost all that one day would you be able to build that up again? And hopefully faster? And most people would say yes.

Mathew Robinson:

So what is he most excited about today?

Tyrone Shum:

One of our big goals is to inspire over 500,000 people to listen to this podcast. So we've had over 100,000 downloads so that's one-fifth of the way there and if we can reach 500,000 downloads by the end of next year, which is 2018, I think that would be an exciting thing for this podcast and it'll reach a lot more people. I love everyone to be along the journey with us to do that and support us along the way. You know, for us to give back to you in some shape or form and help you in your own property investing journey as well. So that's really exciting for me.

Mathew Robinson:

If you would like to connect with Tyrone, you can do so via email, text, social media, or through the Property Investory website.

Tyrone Shum:

The best way to connect with me is you can either send me an email at [email protected], or connect with me on Facebook or via texting to a specific number which I have available which is 0499 88 10 40 and I will respond to you and we can start over the line of communication.

Also, the other thing you can do as well subscribes to the podcast by listening to it iTunes and also you can download our free case studies which we have available at www.propertyinvestory.com. Some way or another when you connect with me through there, I'll definitely be able to respond and will open communication.

And I actually will be opening up very soon a private community where if you want to actually get in touch with me directly and get some mentoring, coaching and also support from other experts as well, that will be opened up shortly as well. So just keep an eye out for that and simply subscribe on www.propertyinvestory.com and you'll hear more about it.

Our Vision

Be the most trusted and innovative brand among the community of property developers and investors in Australia.
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